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artofbonsai.org • View topic - Defining Bonsai
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 Post subject: Re:
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 11:04 am 
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Al,

We are in agreement here. My statements, regardless of the type of plant used as an example, were meant to disprove the common assumption that a bonsai is any plant in a pot and that the definition of "plant in a pot or tray" is flawed.

As you reiterated for me, it is the treatment given to the plant in a pot that defines it as bonsai and not the mere fact alone that it is growing in a pot.
"A living, artistically created, idealized vision of a tree, cultivated in a container."

Defining Kusomono, or Ikebana will have to come at another time.

Respectfully,
Will


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 Post subject: Back to Walter's comment.
PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 8:43 am 
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 Post subject: Open eyes see the best
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 Post subject: Re: Back to Walter's comment.
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 Post subject: Re:
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2007 7:29 pm 
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why not just look at other definitions an easy way would with
sculpture :Three-dimensional art produced especially by forming hard or plastic materials into three-dimensional objects, usually by carving or modeling. The designs may be produced in freestanding objects (i.e., in the round), in relief, or in environments, and a variety of media may be used, including clay, wax, stone, metal, fabric, wood, plaster, rubber, and found objects. Materials may be carved, modeled, molded, cast, wrought, welded, sewn, or assembled and combined.

So we can go the easy way and say
Bonsai : Three dimensional art produced by forming or modifing contained trees or scrubs into three dimensional objects, usually by carving or modeling. The desings may be produced in freestanding objects (i.e., in the round), in relief, or in contained environments, and a variety of species may be used.

This is a simple definition, for both but well, and yes who is to say what art is, definetly not the british!!! just jocking after reading bonsai is not an art written by Walter. funny stuff, but probably the british art council was not educated about bonsai and just see the definition of tree in pot or plant in pot, and therefore you get no funding (at least from the british art council)
Obviously in the simple definition there will be words we can?t define,
Art, Soul, life! etc they have different meanings, and some like life our ignorance does not allow a good definition for it. So basically there are several degrees of freedom from each person, which depend on their knoledge to see and taste differently. The artistic trees I loved as a child I wold not consider artistic any more!

Enrique


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 Post subject: Re: Defining Bonsai - by Will Heath
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 Post subject: Re: Defining Bonsai - by Will Heath
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 Post subject: To the Eristic part then..
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To play the Devil's advocate here....

Why must a line be drawn at all? In other art forms, the techniques to create the art are not as important as the visual result. Take painting for example, who cares if the color is from water colors, oils, crushed berries....it is the final result that determines the artistic success. Who cares if sand was added to the paint for texture, if a spray gun or a brush was used, if the brush was hair from virgin camels or human hair, who cares if the artist used his hands or his teeth, none of it matters in the least.

The only questions that should be answered when judging is, is it alive and is it artistically successful.

Grafting of roots and branches, tricks for foliage reduction, hiding unhealed scars, wiring branches down the back of the trunk, and other such "cheats" are readily accepted by the community, why not others?

All bonsai are man made, none are truly natural, to be so would go against what bonsai is, an artistic creation by man. Why muzzle creativity in a art form that has so little....?

We should define bonsai as "A living, artistically created, idealized vision of a tree, cultivated in a container" and not place restrictions on artistic creativity. If a piece meets the definition, it is bonsai and should be judged as such.


Will


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Last edited by Attila Soos on Sat Jan 26, 2008 1:38 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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